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One of the most difficult things with dementia patients, to be honest. They DO become obsessed with the bowels. You might try citrucel capsules to add a bit more bulk and regularity, but only if the person can take at least a full glass of water with each capsule; otherwise constipation will be increased. Sure wish you luck. Very difficult to distract a senior obsessed with the bowels.
I don't see you make mention of dementia? Give dad a nice bowl of prunes with breakfast and dinner daily and I'll betcha an XL roll of toilet paper he will poop daily, like clockwork. 😂😁
So many people become obsessed with the bathroom! My husband’s grandmother was the absolute worst. She would bring up the topic at the dinner table. I would totally lose my appetite! 😁
CamilleR, welcome to the forum. You mention "he thinks he must go every day". I don't see anything wrong with wanting to go every day. Each person's body has their own mechanics from every other day to 3 or 4 times each day.
If your Dad has memory issues, this obsession will fade away and he will be focusing on something else.
This reminds me how my mother was. She took Miralax every day for 9 years! If she couldn't poop she'd eat prunes & bran cereal. She still ended up admitted to the hospital a couple times for severe constipation.
I have told my FIL he would never have survived as a postpartum mom. For the record, FIL doesn't have dementia, maybe some age related decline - he's almost 90 (but is also a true narcissist, if that matters). But otherwise according to his doctors he's mentally competent. He thinks if he doesn't go AT LEAST once a day - but his actual gold standard is twice - that he is constipated. He asks for a laxative (not fiber but an actual strong laxative) every single day.
(P.S. he doesn't get one at home, but unfortunately he has been given one at the rehab facility that he has been in since the end of November and he is coming home next week....we may have to call his doctor to figure out how to wean him because that may be a genuine medical issue - he may actually get constipated for the first time in his life coming off of laxatives every single day for 2 months)
Additionally - like NeedHelp's husband's grandmother - he has no filter and for some reason thinks bathroom talk is totally appropriate dinner conversation. We used to combine families for dinners. My grandmother refuses to eat with him anymore due to his stellar conversation skills (and his equally lovely table manners)
The absolute worst was the night we were at dinner and he went into complete detail, and now that he is hearing aid dependent but refuses to wear them, didn't realize (or just didn't care) that his conversation was very....audible. We were trying to get him to lower his voice....or you know....STOP. The dining room was fairly empty thank goodness. But from where I was sitting I could tell that the lady sitting at a table across the way could hear every word he was saying. She had gone white as a sheet and put her fork down. She was already very gracious about his lack of table manners (for which we had to leave an over the top tip for the poor waitress, because WE offered to clean up the aftermath and she wouldn't let us - there is a reason we just can't take him out besides his lack of mobility and incontinence) - And yes, on the way out of the restaurant I did apologize to her - I was mortified. She just shook her head and said she had a grandfather that was "like that too" - and I didn't correct her LOL. Honestly its a lot easier to let people jump to their own conclusion about his mental capacity than to explain that he is perfectly competent, but is an aging narcissist with no filter that doesn't care that he ruined their dinner, but I digress.
So I agree with others, trying to distract them - I just don't know - we haven't been super successful at it. In fact when we try to distract him, it honestly makes it worse. He hyperfocuses on it. Thinks he is going to die and actually wants to involve the family in his trips to the bathroom to investigate and I'm not going to horrify you with anymore about that but sufficed to say we just let him be obsessed all by his little lonesome. But I'll boil it down to this. Nothing is sacred or private anymore. And there are no filters anymore about something that should be private. So we do our best to just ignore it. When he brings it up we leave the room or change the subject if we can't get away from him. I think the more attention you bring to it, the more they are going to focus on it.
I think their world narrows down to the things that impact them of course. And their bodies are their focus. And they track every little thing that is happening to their body. And that is something that they want to micromanage and they zero in on it. I can't explain it, but you aren't alone.
Its because our health system tells them that. Every time my Mom was in the hospital and it was only 3 or 4 days, they would start her on laxatives and keep pumping them in until she went. My Mom did not go everyday. When I had my colonoscopy, of course I was asked about my bowel movement. He was not happy and told me to start on a laxative. I stayed on it for a month and saw no difference.
My 96 yo MIL is the same way. Used to give herself hemeroids (sp?) trying to poop every morning. Geez, just let nature take it's course, will ya? You do NOT need to poop every day and you certainly can't force it. I HATE talking about it so I'm always like lalalalala. She's in a SNF now and after X number of days they start a protocol of prunes, miralax, etc. until the big event happens. But X = 3 or 4, not 1.
I guess all you can do is change the subject and refuse to engage. Maybe say "that's OK, maybe later" and then tell him about the weather!
I take Trazadone for sleep every night, and constipation is one side effect. I eat a dried prune with it most nights that works. If I miss one day of bowel movement, my waste becomes so dense that it clogs the toilet. So yes, it depends on each individual's system.
It’s not an obsession if you do your research we do suppose to go daily but no one is eating enough fiber. Leave him alone and tell him it’s ok . Ur right I will just give u fruits, veggies, beans. Kiwi fruits are really good. U don’t need medications. Just natural God given plant base foods. Trust be he has lived long for nothing. He knows what he’s talking about. If he can’t eat it make smoothies. U have the internet look up how to make healthy veggie and fruity drinks and google read up and stay woke and hd must still bd able to go for walks is not move body in the body daily movement helps the waste come out. God Bless and listen to him.
Did know they have prune juice. Sometime juice warm of up snd let him or her drink it start out small it’s healthy . Google it!!!! U can drink it cold or warm . Warm he may go faster.
Give him a Bowl of Oatmeal and a banana . A Banana in the Morning everyday is the best solution. Also a high fiber cereal with blue berries or strawberries . You should Poop Once a day . Rice Milk or Bolton House Chai Tea milk In the produce section does the trick .
Others have already given lots of practical suggestions so I just want to try and encourage you as his caregiver. My father was almost 91 when he died and he too was totally obsessed the last couple of years. Try to accept knowing it seems to be something we all may do if we live long enough and there may be nothing you can do to totally distract him. Even if he is regular, he may begin focusing on the one for tomorrow. I am wondering if it is because by then many have had more than a few bouts of severe constipation and it is something most people do not want to face again. In fact, I am the one who becomes concerned (not obsessed) when my husband goes a couple of days without going because I have seen what constipation can do to him. Fortunately, he has not seemed concerned yet.
Magnesium. And maybe give him some credit. Maybe he feels like he needs to go and can't...which I would call self-care rather than an obsession. When I don't get enough magnesium I "obsess" about my bowels as well. Truly healthy people should poop three times a day.
My mom is the same! Due to slow mobility and other stomach issues, she gets constipated. We get her Miralax (every AM) and probiotics (key!) prunes and green tea. It helps a lot! The elderly hyper-focus on things. DO NOT give laxatives everyday. They further cause the body to rely on them.
Puzzled…you say “DO NOT give laxatives everyday.” However, you also say you give your mom “Miralax (every AM)”. Miralax is a laxative (I’ve heard it contains an ingredient found in antifreeze?). So you give your mom a laxative every day but tell others not to?
Everyone is giving you advice related to constipation, I don't know if that is at the root of your question but many people with dementia seem to have toileting related obsessions and compulsions that go well beyond simply adding a laxative. To quote verywellhealth:
"If the obsessions and compulsions interfere with safety or are causing the person emotional distress, they should be addressed and reported to the physician. Sometimes, verbal reassurances or distractions are helpful to people. Other people benefit from treatment with SSRIs, a class of antidepressants with fewer side effects that seems to be beneficial and provide some relief from OCD. " https://www.verywellhealth.com/coping-with-obsessive-compulsive-behavior-97616
Your bowel movement is also a primal, natural, source of body control. "Losing" control of your bowels, psychologically, has an impact on the psyche. It can be very scary. Losing control, either way translates to losing control over anything, so they are not only losing control over their bowels, they have lost control of their lives in some manner. They'll want to hang on in any way they can. All the other answers are helpful. However, it is not necessary to have three bowel movements a day. The best to you and yours.
Good morning, you did not say if your father has cognitive issues or Alz. My father had early onset Alz and poop was an issue, but different than your fathers. I care for my husband who is bedridden. Though we do exercises in the bed he still does not get enough activity as a upright person would. Therefore, we keep track of his bm's on a board. Time and Date. That way we both know when he should be due for his next bm and I increase his fiber/vegetable if needed. Your father at age 90 probably does not move enough to make it happen every day. In the past I used Miralax for my husband but then realized if he ate enough fiber/vegis, drank enough fluids we did not need the Miralax.
I believe the average bm is 3 times a day to once every 3 days. So maybe your father will understand that his bm is normal if he falls within this range. Good luck!!
First it doesn’t seem surprising to me that our bathroom needs/habits change as we age. When activity and exercise change our apatite usually does too, the more sedentary we become the less conscious we become of what we are eating and our taste buds often dull at the same time so sweet and salty, carbs are what many gravitate to more than ever. Less activity, less actual hunger, less fiber, less need for bowel movements. Thirst is the same problem. This is an over simplification of course but less good healthy food combined with less activity, movement creates less movement in the bathroom. Maybe men in particular but certainly the generation that’s in their 80’s+ and any farmers younger probably have locked themselves in the “reading room” at the same time every day to have a bowel movement all of their lives and breaking that habit as well as bodily function they have always counted on must be as foreign as anything about advancing in age. Your fathers obsession might be a good opportunity to stress the importance of adequate hydration (not just when he’s thirsty) plenty of walking and exercise as well as a balanced diet with fiber which might be harder for you than him if you are preparing the food. You also should take him to his doctor to talk about it in case there is some real issue going on, especially if he likes and trusts his doctor so that if there isn’t anything actually wrong the doctor can explain it to him and make suggestions. Personally I would caution about laxatives like Miralax and use fiber like Metamucil first, they work in different ways and long time use of laxatives can cause more problems. It’s best to use them only short term and in specific circumstances or need but that’s my experience and interpretation so of course use your own judgment. It’s easy to get the two confused since they can both treat, for lack of a better term, the same thing.
If he is constipated that would be a good reason to complain. I have found extra-virgin olive oil helps with constipation and making the stools softer. Just a spoonful is all it takes. There are other oils as well like castor oil or flaxseed oil that are good. Make sure he is not getting dehydrated and is drinking enough as well.
How does his obsession end up harming him or you? How much of a problem is his complaining for you? Do you think he is overly anxious and upsetting himself for an unnecessary concern? Do you wish that you could keep him happy? What's his level of upset? What does he do if you don't distract him? Is he damaging himself by self medicating? What's his diet like? How much fluid does he ingest?
My grandmother had the same obsession. She used to dose us with milk of magnesia (which unlike most people I find delicious). Near the end of her life she came to live with us, overdosed on Tums and ended up shitting the bed. We were all too horrified to deal with the mess. But her daughter, my mother, who wasn't so fond of her, firmly got her to the bathroom, cleaned her up, changed the sheets. And soon had her moved to a nursing home where, so far as I know, she did not soil herself again. However, I doubt they allowed her access to self-medicate.
What if he COULD go poop every day? Would that solve the problem? Magnesium is associated with looser stool. Also high dose vitamin C that you can get from buffered powdered C will cause stool to be softer, looser, and easier to pass. I am 80. I am passing 2 or 3 well formed stool every day and really enjoying it.
As for the doses, start with 500 mg. of C and increase until the stool gets softer. With the magnesium, I guess you could do the same thing. I think powders are more effective than pills. I use a mineral supplement called Tri-Salts from Ecological formulas.
I don't think you can and frankly even if you could eventually you will have to keep to finding new ways to distract him. OCD behaviors are exhausting.
How does his obsession end up harming him or you? How much of a problem is his complaining for you? Do you think he is overly anxious and upsetting himself for an unnecessary concern? Do you wish that you could keep him happy? What's his level of upset? What does he do if you don't distract him? Is he damaging himself by self medicating? What's his diet like? How much fluid does he ingest?
My grandmother had the same obsession. She used to dose us with milk of magnesia (which unlike most people I find delicious). Near the end of her life she came to live with us, overdosed on Tums and ended up sh*tting the bed. We were all too horrified to deal with the mess. But her daughter, my mother, who wasn't so fond of her, firmly got her to the bathroom, cleaned her up, changed the sheets. And soon had her moved to a nursing home where, so far as I know, she did not soil herself again. However, I doubt they allowed her access to self-medicate.
What if he COULD go poop every day? Would that solve the problem? Magnesium is associated with looser stool. Also high dose vitamin C that you can get from buffered powdered C will cause stool to be softer, looser, and easier to pass. I am 80. I am passing 2 or 3 well formed stool every day and really enjoying it.
As for the doses, start with 500 mg. of C and increase until the stool gets softer. With the magnesium, I guess you could do the same thing. I think powders are more effective than pills. I use a mineral supplement called Tri-Salts from Ecological formulas.
Yeah, it's like, will the doctor get a stool sample for the lab to test for occult cancer? You end up so obsessed trying to poo poo that your constipated and lucky to pass rock hard pieces on your part!
Don't forget that many medications cause constipation as a side effect.
The poop thing is real for many elderly. More than likely it comes from people who used to go daily, same time, very regular. Then the body slows down. When body slows down, gut slows down. Walking is one exercise that keeps the wheels in motion and he probably does more sitting these days that moving around.
Check his meds. Nearly all of them have a 'constipation' side effect. Doctors will recommend a fiber product like miralax or even a stool softener like colace. Try that with him. Then there are the old fashioned remedies like hot lemon juice each morning, papaya (a great mover), hot prune juice. Me, I would try the naturals before doing the miralax. Or even the colace - a couple of those a day. Just pick something and try it each day for about a week or so to see how it works. Don't start mixing them or you'll be dealing with the very loose bowel and that creates constipation for several days because you cleaned the gut out so well.
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Add fiber. Also lots of water.
If your Dad has memory issues, this obsession will fade away and he will be focusing on something else.
(P.S. he doesn't get one at home, but unfortunately he has been given one at the rehab facility that he has been in since the end of November and he is coming home next week....we may have to call his doctor to figure out how to wean him because that may be a genuine medical issue - he may actually get constipated for the first time in his life coming off of laxatives every single day for 2 months)
Additionally - like NeedHelp's husband's grandmother - he has no filter and for some reason thinks bathroom talk is totally appropriate dinner conversation. We used to combine families for dinners. My grandmother refuses to eat with him anymore due to his stellar conversation skills (and his equally lovely table manners)
The absolute worst was the night we were at dinner and he went into complete detail, and now that he is hearing aid dependent but refuses to wear them, didn't realize (or just didn't care) that his conversation was very....audible. We were trying to get him to lower his voice....or you know....STOP. The dining room was fairly empty thank goodness. But from where I was sitting I could tell that the lady sitting at a table across the way could hear every word he was saying. She had gone white as a sheet and put her fork down. She was already very gracious about his lack of table manners (for which we had to leave an over the top tip for the poor waitress, because WE offered to clean up the aftermath and she wouldn't let us - there is a reason we just can't take him out besides his lack of mobility and incontinence) - And yes, on the way out of the restaurant I did apologize to her - I was mortified. She just shook her head and said she had a grandfather that was "like that too" - and I didn't correct her LOL. Honestly its a lot easier to let people jump to their own conclusion about his mental capacity than to explain that he is perfectly competent, but is an aging narcissist with no filter that doesn't care that he ruined their dinner, but I digress.
So I agree with others, trying to distract them - I just don't know - we haven't been super successful at it. In fact when we try to distract him, it honestly makes it worse. He hyperfocuses on it. Thinks he is going to die and actually wants to involve the family in his trips to the bathroom to investigate and I'm not going to horrify you with anymore about that but sufficed to say we just let him be obsessed all by his little lonesome. But I'll boil it down to this. Nothing is sacred or private anymore. And there are no filters anymore about something that should be private. So we do our best to just ignore it. When he brings it up we leave the room or change the subject if we can't get away from him. I think the more attention you bring to it, the more they are going to focus on it.
I think their world narrows down to the things that impact them of course. And their bodies are their focus. And they track every little thing that is happening to their body. And that is something that they want to micromanage and they zero in on it. I can't explain it, but you aren't alone.
I guess all you can do is change the subject and refuse to engage. Maybe say "that's OK, maybe later" and then tell him about the weather!
"If the obsessions and compulsions interfere with safety or are causing the person emotional distress, they should be addressed and reported to the physician. Sometimes, verbal reassurances or distractions are helpful to people. Other people benefit from treatment with SSRIs, a class of antidepressants with fewer side effects that seems to be beneficial and provide some relief from OCD. "
https://www.verywellhealth.com/coping-with-obsessive-compulsive-behavior-97616
I believe the average bm is 3 times a day to once every 3 days. So maybe your father will understand that his bm is normal if he falls within this range. Good luck!!
My grandmother had the same obsession. She used to dose us with milk of magnesia (which unlike most people I find delicious). Near the end of her life she came to live with us, overdosed on Tums and ended up shitting the bed. We were all too horrified to deal with the mess. But her daughter, my mother, who wasn't so fond of her, firmly got her to the bathroom, cleaned her up, changed the sheets. And soon had her moved to a nursing home where, so far as I know, she did not soil herself again. However, I doubt they allowed her access to self-medicate.
What if he COULD go poop every day? Would that solve the problem? Magnesium is associated with looser stool. Also high dose vitamin C that you can get from buffered powdered C will cause stool to be softer, looser, and easier to pass. I am 80. I am passing 2 or 3 well formed stool every day and really enjoying it.
As for the doses, start with 500 mg. of C and increase until the stool gets softer. With the magnesium, I guess you could do the same thing. I think powders are more effective than pills. I use a mineral supplement called Tri-Salts from Ecological formulas.
My grandmother had the same obsession. She used to dose us with milk of magnesia (which unlike most people I find delicious). Near the end of her life she came to live with us, overdosed on Tums and ended up sh*tting the bed. We were all too horrified to deal with the mess. But her daughter, my mother, who wasn't so fond of her, firmly got her to the bathroom, cleaned her up, changed the sheets. And soon had her moved to a nursing home where, so far as I know, she did not soil herself again. However, I doubt they allowed her access to self-medicate.
What if he COULD go poop every day? Would that solve the problem? Magnesium is associated with looser stool. Also high dose vitamin C that you can get from buffered powdered C will cause stool to be softer, looser, and easier to pass. I am 80. I am passing 2 or 3 well formed stool every day and really enjoying it.
As for the doses, start with 500 mg. of C and increase until the stool gets softer. With the magnesium, I guess you could do the same thing. I think powders are more effective than pills. I use a mineral supplement called Tri-Salts from Ecological formulas.
Yeah, it's like, will the doctor get a stool sample for the lab to test for occult cancer? You end up so obsessed trying to poo poo that your constipated and lucky to pass rock hard pieces on your part!
Don't forget that many medications cause constipation as a side effect.
Check his meds. Nearly all of them have a 'constipation' side effect. Doctors will recommend a fiber product like miralax or even a stool softener like colace. Try that with him. Then there are the old fashioned remedies like hot lemon juice each morning, papaya (a great mover), hot prune juice. Me, I would try the naturals before doing the miralax. Or even the colace - a couple of those a day. Just pick something and try it each day for about a week or so to see how it works. Don't start mixing them or you'll be dealing with the very loose bowel and that creates constipation for several days because you cleaned the gut out so well.
Been there, done all that!!